Permit renewal?

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Ian Hoolahan
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:22 am
Location: NW UK

Permit renewal?

Post by Ian Hoolahan » Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:05 am

Permit will expire end of March, I am sure there are many others who will have permits expiring in this period which, as things stand will of course mean a large number to renew when restrictions are lifted, has any thought been given as to how this will be addressed?
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Chris Martyr
Posts: 584
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:58 am
Location: Horsted Keynes Sussex

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by Chris Martyr » Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:42 pm

Ian.
I am in a similar situation with a Permit that runs out at about the same time .

One thing we do know about our fabulous Turweston staff is how incredibly quick they are normally when it comes to turning PtF applications around . Now , I think 2020 may just be the year where we can excuse them for not getting the normal ‘return of post’ response . But I bet they’re not too far off the mark though . And even if mine doesn’t come back within the customary 3 days , I’ll certainly not be making any complaints . Not with these circumstances .

And if there’s an organisation which has a bit of ‘Dunkirk spirit’ to it ......It’s the LAA.. :D :D
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samh116
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 2:22 pm

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by samh116 » Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:42 pm

You are absolutely correct there Chris

G-ASEB permit inspection last Saturday (21st)
Test flight on Monday
Posted paperwork Tuesday

Received Email copy of Certificate of Validity Friday!!

Couldn't expect better than that.
Sam Harper
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C Rule
Posts: 153
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:00 pm
Location: South of 70 north

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by C Rule » Mon Mar 30, 2020 7:37 pm

I wonder in view of the closure of many airfields and the prohibition of travel for non-essential reasons if any thought has been given to extending permit validity for say 6 months /50 hours?
I would not feel happy to ask my inspector who like me would be classed as a member of the vulnerable group to carry out a renewal for many weeks.
Colin Rule
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LSHAvenger18
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 8:58 am

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by LSHAvenger18 » Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:43 am

Hoping that I can get some sort of extension too.

Was unlucky in that I got caught after Inspector sign-off, but before test flight!
So my permission to test will almost certainly expire before we are let out.

This will take me outside the permit expiration plus one-year.
Which then needs LAA permission to test, rather than local Inspector.
18 months getting aircraft sorted - lock-down came evening prior to airtest!

Still, some exemptions already already out there - so am hoping pragmatism rules.

There will be a lot of clubs & businesses suffering badly - this is the start of the season!
Simon Heighway
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JJennings
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:25 am

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by JJennings » Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:26 am

I too have been effectively grounded my Mr Slaters comments.
Permit work done safely.
Inspection done safely.
Not allowed to do test flight, so LAA will require another inspection as they are insisting on 28 day max between inspection/test flight and application.

Fair??????
Best,
John
John Jennings
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Jerry Parr
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:25 am

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by Jerry Parr » Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:33 pm

JJennings wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:26 am
I too have been effectively grounded my Mr Slaters comments.
Permit work done safely.
Inspection done safely.
Not allowed to do test flight, so LAA will require another inspection as they are insisting on 28 day max between inspection/test flight and application.

Fair??????
Best,
John
Dear Mr Jennings

A minor point of correction if I may: the procedures for revalidating a Permit to Fly require that the FWR-1 Permit to Fly revalidation application is received by LAA Engineering within one month of the date of signature in 'Section 3: Declaration by Inspector'.

This is what I have said in the email that I sent to you over the current situation this morning, at 1055 hrs.

Furthermore, we have not said that the aircraft requires another inspection, merely that the inspector declaration may need resigning and dating if the submission of the application falls outside the one month requirement. This is to confirm that the aircraft remains in an airworthy condition.

The date of the check flight does not come into the date requirements (within reason).

LAA Engineering continue to process Permit to Fly revalidation applications as normal and we have revalidated over 60 in the last week.

Despite a number of discussions on the matter, to date LAA Engineering have not managed to identify a safety case warranting extensions to the Permit to Fly Certificates of Validity.

Come the 'all clear', LAA Engineering can call on the services of 10 engineering staff to input Permit to Fly revalidation applications onto the system (LAA and CAA) and there are at least six of us who are authorised for signing the revalidation applications. Normally, just two staff deal with the revalidation applications - 2750 of them in 2019.

For aircraft where the Permit to Fly has expired for less than 12 months, an inspector can issue a Permit Flight Release Certificate (PFRC) authorising flight for the purposes of carrying out the Permit to Fly revalidation check flight. Once this has been completed, the FWR-1 is submitted to LAA Engineering who will revalidate the Permit to Fly as long as everything is in order.

For aircraft that have Permits to Fly that have expired for more than 12 months, prior to the Permit to Fly revalidation check flight being conducted, work with your inspector to complete the FWR-1 Permit to Fly revalidation application up to and including Section 3. Submit this with copies of any associated worksheets to LAA Engineering and we will issue the PFRC authorising the check flight.

If anyone has any queries regarding the Permit to Fly revalidation process, please email the normal 'engineering@...' email address.

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Steve Slater
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 5:57 pm

Re: Permit renewal?

Post by Steve Slater » Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:51 pm

JJennings wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:26 am
I too have been effectively grounded my Mr Slaters comments.
Permit work done safely.
Inspection done safely.
Not allowed to do test flight, so LAA will require another inspection as they are insisting on 28 day max between inspection/test flight and application.

Fair??????
Best,
John
John. I'm surprised at your comment on being "grounded by Mr Slater's comments".

To set the record straight, and as explained by Jerry Parr in his e-mail to you this morning, we have NOT made any attempt to 'ground' the LAA fleet. Indeed we have lobbied for the opposite, to not ban VFR flying outright, which allows essential positioning flights to remain legal. Our philosophy is that we are all grown-ups and can make our own decisions.

However Government advice is clear, that leisure flying and travel to airfields for leisure flying is not deemed essential transport and could therefore be regarded as an offence.

As far as your Permit renewal is concerned. Jerry has already outlined how we can best help you, but sadly it is academic at the moment. The most important thing is that we all stay safe and healthy so we are all around to fly again once the restrictions can be lifted.
Stephen Slater
034052

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