LAA 2011 Member Survey - We need your Views

Chris B · Post by **Chris B** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:04 pm

I have just found an e-mail from [email protected] in my Spam box entitled LAA 2011 Member Survey - We need your Views.

I've completed the survey and awaiting the Viagra to arrive...

Chris

Ian Melville · Post by **Ian Melville** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:14 pm

I didn't know there was a restriction on owner maintenance of permit aircraft. Or does that just refer to manufactured aircraft now on the permit system?

Tom Sheppard · Post by **Tom Sheppard** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:23 pm

Likewise. The penultimate question: what can you offer?
Six or seven different administrative suits and "engineer". Not woodwork, mechanics, metalwork, electrics, materials technologist, mathematician, Meteorologist, teacher; no Sir. Just the pen pushers.
My view on organisations that need consultants and mission statements can not be politely entered here but it does seem to me that nobody in this organisation is having fun being here and that is the thing that most needs addressing. The local strut seems not to exist, the next one out didn't reply to my email enquiring where and when to meet them and I'm usually on my own on the forum*. So far my experience of the LAA is disappointing. Where are all these like minded souls? At an early age, I read "Birds and Fools Fly" and dreamed that one day I'd be in a position to join the PFA. So far it is not living up to expectations.

*Solent strut: no sign on the map, no longer exists?
Andover Strut meets (When? there is no website.)
Wiltshire flyers have a site and I could have gone to their next meeting last November.

Alan George · Post by **Alan George** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 8:54 pm

Tom,

Where are you based? The Bristol Wing (Strut) is active, see the latest newsletter on

http://www.bristol-wing.co.uk/index.htm

and the next meeting is on Wednesday 6 April 2011.

Regards, Alan.

Tom Sheppard · Post by **Tom Sheppard** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 9:04 pm

Thank you Alan. I'm in Bournemouth.

Dave Hall · Post by **Dave Hall** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 11:40 pm

That's a bit far for an evening.

There's a very active Christchurch branch of the RAeS - I wonder if they would know of local light aircraft flyers. I don't know the farm strips in the area though. If you can get a look at Lockyers Guide there could be some listed in there.

Maybe if you ask Penny in the Office she could do a search of the BH postcode for LAA members. I am not suggesting it's a way to create an instant strut, but it might give you some people to contact. I'm from down that way, but now live near Bristol (for the last 45 years!). Salisbury would be about an hour away I guess - Old Sarum might have a few active flyers. You should be able to get a contact for Andover Strut. They're helping with the Popham weekend in May I think.

Brian Hope · Post by **Brian Hope** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:02 am

Hi Tom, sorry to hear that your LAA experience has not thus far reached your expectations, may I suggest a couple of ideas. Andover Strut is active, in fact they will be running the LAA stand at the Microlight Fair at Popham at the end of April, and they also run the campsite and car park at the Rally.
The coordinator is Keith Picton [email protected] or Tel 01264 396 074. If it was Keith you emailed before then why not give him a ring, not everybody checks their email regularly and it is easy to forget to reply once it drops off the radar. Alternatively give Eryl Smith a try on [email protected] Eryl is an active Andover member.
You could also pop into any local strips or airfields that are accessible and ask around for any active LAA groups of members. I'm sure they would be happy to chat about their aeroplanes and offer advice should you be seeking it.
LAA is about self help, you get out what you put in. That doesn't excuse people not responding when you try to contact them but as in anything where you want to achieve something, you can't give up at the first hurdle. Hang in there, get out and about and very soon you will meet LAA members who share your interests and who will welcome you into this wonderful world of LAA aviation.
Rgds, Brian

Tom Sheppard · Post by **Tom Sheppard** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:54 am

Thank you both for your help. I shall certainly make contact with the Andover strut.

Andrew Leak · Post by **Andrew Leak** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:37 am

Hi Tom,
I can say I have had pretty much the same experience. I did go to the Solent Strut meets for a while, but didn't feel too welcome as I didn't have a 'spam can' and some of the group was a bit of a 'closed shop' at times (sorry former Solent 'Strutters' but that's my opinion). When it disbanded I wasn't surprised as I gave it a good shot, but I believe it just ran out of steam which is really sad as it was only a tenner a year and some members did give it a good go over the years. I live in Southampton and the meetings were just down the road from me but Andover is too far for an evening (plus all that fuel).

The LAA forum has calmed down a lot lately, not that revealing your actual identity that was forced on members recently has caused most to retract their input, but I believe that the Association has got a lot to offer. I am keen as mustard still and love talking and flying aeroplanes and gliders. The European regulations that keep rearing their ugly heads is a bit of a passion killer though as a good few friends have stopped flying and gone to what they believe are less suffocating hobbies now - one friend (not an LAA member) was actually flying illegally on but didn't realise until his bi-annual, that's how difficult some of the red tape is getting as the licensing is changing. But on the whole, if you keep an eye on the LAA website and forums you will always find someone with the knowledge to help out, the only thing we can't get through the LAA is cut-price fuel, now that would be nice!

You'll find me on the forum and a good few other regulars too, look, I'm replying to you along with the others on this thread...fret ye not!

Regards,

Andrew

Chris B · Post by **Chris B** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:30 pm

Hello Tom,

The LAA is a company (LAA Ltd.) in which members have a single share. LAA Ltd consists of a top class Engineering department which fulfills the contractual obligations of an exposition with the CAA to provide airworthiness recommendations for ascribed Permit aircraft. It also has a CEO with administrative support. There are some underpinning Rules but otherwise - that's it.

There is a Board which, apart from the CEO, are all elected member volunteers. One board member works with the CEO to produce Light Aviation magazine. They all do their best to cover the management disciplines that larger companies take for granted.

Everything else relies on volunteers or volunteer support. Some examples are: The Rally, Aero Expo, Photo Library, Party in the Park, Struts, Type Groups, regulatory, lobbying, the website and the Bulletin Board.

The vast majority of whinges on this bulletin board are, often in ignorance, aimed at volunteers and it can't be pleasant. I guess it's one of the reasons why the LAA has trouble finding volunteers.

The light aircraft market and the regulatory environments are changing and LAA Ltd is moving with it to take advantage. Some members are finding this transition difficult.

Overall, the costs of membership and engineering services are very good value for money. All I can say is try to understand where the LAA is coming from, enjoy it and help where you can (but don't get upset if others criticise what you do).

Chris

Tom Sheppard · Post by **Tom Sheppard** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:51 pm

Fine. So If I propose a pub gathering on a Friday night in the Southampton area, nothing formal, just a chance to put names to faces and chat over a beer, would there be any takers? PM me if you're interested.

Chris B · Post by **Chris B** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 7:22 pm

Tom,

I'm not sure if that will work very well. There are probably only a couple of hundred regular Forum browsers from a membership of 8K spread all over the UK.

I'm not sure how you go about getting your offer to the broader membership in the Southampton area. Perhaps ask Brian Hope to put a couple of lines in LA or an HQ e-mail shot based on postcodes.

The thread has drifted a bit. Sorry.

Has anyone not received a request to take part in the survey?

Chris

Tom Sheppard · Post by **Tom Sheppard** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:15 pm

One in Forty? Ya mean all this is for the benefit of two and a half percent of us? So ninety seven and a half percent of the input advice and knowledge doesn't wind up here?

Somebody has evidently broken this thing real good.

If the citizens don't attend the forum, what does that say about their attitude to the governance they are receiving?
While I appreciate the efforts of those who volunteer, If thirty nine out of forty are being alienated then it is NECCESSARY to change the policy on anonymity (safeguarding with the requirement that only paid up members can post so you know it is coming from inside the tent), otherwise the pool of volunteers shrinks to a puddle and becomes completely unrepresentative of the members' wants and needs.
These latter have to be out in the open. The survey results will doubtless be analysed and published in LA but with such a small group presiding over the analysis, will we get what we need?

The LAA is the only means by which ordinary people on ordinary wages can own and operate their own aircraft. I am concerned that the impecunious flyer may find little here to keep him enthused and that the builder support network that this forum should advance is withering as a result.

Over the past ten years, amateur watchmakers have used the internet to democratise the knowledge to the point where I could become a competent repairer and restorer in less than three years with good advice, friendly cooperation and ready access to information. True that is worldwide and this association is national but, all the same, I am surprised that such conditions do not appear to exist here.

Brian Hope · Post by **Brian Hope** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:07 pm

Hi Tom, to form a Strut you need ten LAA members to kick it off. I am happy to put something in the magazine giving your contact details so that anybody interested in a Southampton Strut can contact you. If it looks like there is sufficient support for the idea you can then make a formal application to start a Strut. All very simple and at no cost.
Once a Strut is formed, you will be able to get address labels for all LAA members in local postcodes so you can send out a mailshot about your new Strut, plus of course details will appear in the mag and on the website.
Struts vary enormously in size and style, some are very active, some are quite small social gatherings where people just meet up for a pint and a chat. It all depends on the memebers really, they do as they want. When I joined the Mid Kent Strut just over 20 years ago it was a pretty lack lustre affaire of about a dozen souls. Me and a couple of mates had a chat about it to decide whether we should get onto the committee and change things, or walk away. We chose the former and the Kent Strut soon grew into one of the larger Struts and became very active, which I am pleased to say it still is. It's not particularly difficult to do, you just need enthusiasm and a few willing hands to help.

Brian Hope · Post by **Brian Hope** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:17 pm

Tom, you are falling into the trap of believing the internet is a panacea. It is not. The world managed without it for years and for a great many people forums are irrelevant. Even when this forum was active there were only ever about 40 peole who regularly posted on it. Most people have better ways to spend their time, either building flying or working so they can do either.
I was up at the strip today with about ten of the owners, all LAA members. The tractor was fixed so we could mow the strip, a couple were re-fitting the spats to their Luscombe, two other were planning a summer trip to Switzerland and the rest of us were putting the worls to rights. Other than John Dean, who is the moderator, I am the only one who has EVER posted on the forum. The LAA is alive and well, it won't die because you have to use your real name on the forum. Trust me.