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Chris Martyr
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ALL MEMBERS ! Please fill out those proxy forms..!!

Post by Chris Martyr » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:56 pm

I am just having to pinch myself in the arm over this article. Most of it was fictitious claptrap, but I will assume the bit about the motion to be tabled at the 2018 AGM by Stewart Jackson wasn't!

Like most other members, I had assumed that the topic Stewart intends to raise , had its lid firmly banged down 2 years ago.

The person on whose behalf he is acting, gave a reasonably good rendition at the recent Sywell Rally. Also, that same weekend, a somewhat inconvenient forum thread elsewhere was locked down. Surely any decent person would've seen these as positive signs that things were looking up.

Now this! Which I perceive as being somewhat irresponsible on the LAA Vice President's part. Because it doesn't take Einstein to work out what the all-dominating subject is going to be, come Oct 21st. Also, it is somewhat disrespectful to the other guest speakers who are invariably interesting and worthwhile people and whose input will no doubt be somewhat overshadowed by a certain presence.
Irresponsible also, because in the event of this motion being successful, it could then pave the way for the LAA being ridden over roughshod by a certain PR/Legal team and all manner of undesirable actions being brought to bear.

The most likely outcome I feel, will be similar to that of 2016 and will ultimately benefit nobody.
Which poses the unfortunate question: How beneficial is it to our member-driven organisation when a Vice President feels that the wellbeing of that organisation is OK being compromised by the self-serving requirements of one rather manipulative person.
Last edited by Chris Martyr on Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Alan Kilbride
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Alan Kilbride » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:12 pm

Not for me, I'm afraid.

I voted once and I don't like the idea that it isn't accepted by the losing side.
I do hope Stewart rethinks this before it's too late.
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Donald Walker
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Donald Walker » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:19 pm

This link to the article may work better.
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Paul Catanach
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Paul Catanach » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:52 pm

Not this again.........

The matter was closed two years ago. The membership considered the facts, a vote was taken, the membership gave their answer. That should be the end of it. Instead we are now being asked to reverse that democratic decision, coincidentally at the time when a film is about to be released. Cynical, moi?

The lady in question considers the LAA to be "...the old men’s club of British light aviation" (from the Times article). Why then would she want an award from us? If this proposal goes forward I trust the membership will be given ALL the background information including details of the claims made (and refuted) in good time? There's a lot of it out there. Interviews, photographs, video.........that will take a lot of time and work.

To paraphrase Groucho Marx, I would not want to remain a member of a club that would blatantly ignore the will of its membership.

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Chris Martyr
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Chris Martyr » Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:32 pm

Alan Kilbride wrote: I do hope Stewart rethinks this before it's too late.
For him or for her ?
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Marchettiman
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Marchettiman » Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:36 pm

Interestingly the descriptive quote about the LAA as "the old men’s club of British light aviation" which appeared in the online article in The Times this morning has now been edited out. I wonder why?

I am concerned by Roger Hopkinson's reported suggestion in the article that the 2016 vote was "influenced by proxy voting" as though the votes of any of us who cannot attend the AGM are of lesser value than AGM attendees. Can I ask for his reply as to whether postal votes in a LAA forum are of any less value than those from members who do attend an AGM, or was he misquoted?


I have no axe to grind with Ms. Curtiss-Taylor, I have never met her nor spoken with her, but I do have suspicions about any aviator who embelishes the truth, whether by spin or outright bragging. Her quote (from The Times article) "I've had 35 years flying these kind of aeroplanes. I am as experienced as anyone flying them in the world" is simply make-believe, perhaps on a par with her confusion between flying with a vastly more experienced Stearman commercial pilot and "guests" in her aeroplane.


I do hope that the proposed motion to reinstate the award will be carefully reconsidered by its proposer and that the proper business of the LAA can flourish without this distraction.
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Matt Dovey
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Matt Dovey » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:36 am

Why is the Association wasting it time on this. Its got more important things it should be worrying about.
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Alan Cooper
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Alan Cooper » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:37 am

I have been in continuous membership since 1988 and was considering attending the AGM for the the first time this year that is now virtually assured.This matter was satisfactorily resolved and needs to be left behind.The association has many operational issues that need addressing and does not need this distraction.Association awards should only be made for a lifetime of dedicated service to our specific cause.We have no need to get wrapped up in the world of celebrity,patronage and commercial gain.Our membership deserves better than this! Regards Alan
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John Dean
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by John Dean » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:45 am

Matt Dovey wrote:Why is the Association wasting it time on this. Its got more important things it should be worrying about.
The Association doesn't have any choice. Any member is entitled to put forward a proposition for discussion at the AGM providing they do so in accordance with the rules.

dmcnicholl
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by dmcnicholl » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:49 am

Alan Cooper wrote:I have been in continuous membership since 1988 and was considering attending the AGM for the the first time this year that is now virtually assured.This matter was satisfactorily resolved and needs to be left behind.The association has many operational issues that need addressing and does not need this distraction.Association awards should only be made for a lifetime of dedicated service to our specific cause.We have no need to get wrapped up in the world of celebrity,patronage and commercial gain.Our membership deserves better than this! Regards Alan
I have been in continuous membership maybe a decade longer than that and I absolutely agree Alan Cooper's remarks. The matter was decided. Move on.
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samrutherford
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by samrutherford » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:01 am

I'm looking forward to seeing the wording on the motion...

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BobD
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by BobD » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:55 am

I attended the 2016 AGM, and spoke in favour of the motion to rescind the award. The main gist of my comments were that I objected to the misrepresentation of "solo" so much, without correction, and that the Award in future should be presented to an Individual, not a Corporate PR event. My opinion has not changed.

I attended the recent talk given by T-C-T at the LAA Rally, and was pleasantly surprised that she came across as an enthusiastic, competent public speaker. She was much more self-deprecating, and acknowledged the assistance and back-up she had received on her flights, and I came away with the view that the previous problems had been left behind. That is not a reason to re-instate the Award.

Raking over these old coals again in public by presenting another motion at the AGM will do the LAA, (and even T-C-T herself) no favours.
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Planemike
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Planemike » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:01 pm

Marchettiman wrote:I am concerned by Roger Hopkinson's reported suggestion in the article that the 2016 vote was "influenced by proxy voting" as though the votes of any of us who cannot attend the AGM are of lesser value than AGM attendees. Can I ask for his reply as to whether postal votes in a LAA forum are of any less value than those from members who do attend an AGM, or was he misquoted?

I do hope that the proposed motion to reinstate the award will be carefully reconsidered by its proposer and that the proper business of the LAA can flourish without this distraction.
Indeed what difference does it make if the outcome was "influenced by proxy voting" ?? If the vote was carried out in accordance with the Constitution then the result stands no matter how the votes were
gathered in.

Really do hope this matter is sorted out without resorting to the Law. The PFA/LAA is about building and flying recreational aeroplanes, not battling over awards.

Member since the glorious summer of 76 Sywell.
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Chris Martyr
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by Chris Martyr » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:15 pm

John Dean wrote: Any member is entitled to put forward a proposition for discussion at the AGM providing they do so in accordance with the rules.
Would you care to clarify your wording on this John ? A "proposition for discussion" is not what was reported in The Times , it was reported that a "motion will be tabled".

Even so , if it actually is only going to be brought up as an AOB type item , then that is a completely different thing . But if that is the case , then ditch it now ! Because it will only take the focus away from LAA's core activities .
Even the lesser observant will have noticed what the groundswell of opinion is on this topic . The LAA-AGM is about what its members want . Not what Tracey Curtis-Taylor wants .
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John Dean
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Re: The Times . 20/09/2018

Post by John Dean » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:48 pm

I understand that it will be a formal motion with full details in the October magazine.

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